Slava Balbek. About the "Youth" project, difficult clients, "scoops" and taste

/ Interview /

Why в will the new Kyiv restaurant "Molodist" by balbek bureau not have a tram and deer carpets? What is the difference between an architect and a wine? Why should you listen to a designer?я the client? We spoke with Slava Balbek about the latest newsєrelationships with the client, the responsibility of the architect, and preserving the authenticity of historic buildings.

PRAGMATIKA.MEDIA: First, tell us about your latest high-profile project — the Kyiv restaurant "Molodist". How did it change from the initial idea to the final implementation?

Slava Balbek: "Molodist" is the establishment of Odesa restaurateur Alex Cooper, who, together with his Kyiv colleague Mykhailo Beilin, also opened Kyiv Food Market. Both restaurant projects are located in one of the buildings of the former Arsenal factory. The philosophy of "Youth" from the very beginning assumes a joke, frivolity. It's about loud music, "Ivanushki International". There was no design task - it was necessary to create an atmosphere.

We wanted to achieve a kind of wow effect and introduced a structural element from industrial containers, where we placed the bar. Although they originally planned to install a tram, it just didn't park there (smiles). But for our part, we designed everything in such a way that there was a tram: we calculated the weight, agreed with the tram fleet, strengthened the overlap where it could be.

But still, the interior of the restaurant is not exactly design, but rather functionality, which is influenced by a commercial sales machine. It is inconvenient to get on the tram, it is not so effective from the point of view of guests, service and others. And the restaurant is built from the opposite: benefit, strength, beauty. The tram is uncomfortable. And containers are super convenient.

"Molodist" restaurant and Kyiv Food Market are located in one of the former buildings of the "Arsenal" plant, built at the end of the XNUMXth century. Photo: Yevhen Avramenko

The philosophy of "Youth" from the very beginning assumes a joke, frivolity

Slava Balbek. Photo: Yuriy Ferendovych

P.M.: Wasn't it a pity to refuse the tram? Still a really cool idea.

S. B.: For a long time, I have developed such a difficult attitude towards containers: we started and did not finish one container project. He is like a bitten pie. And Cooper and I have long dreamed of making a project with containers. I think we have known him for five years, and we discuss it all the time. And here, at "Molodosta", we had an 8-meter ceiling, where we could afford anything we wanted. Of course, we stuck this container there - disassembled into 12 parts and reassembled.

PM: And now, with the tram, won't there be an unfinished gestalt?

S. B.: Well, this will be the next project (smiles).

P.M.: What happened й did not work в "Youth"?

S. B.: We spent a long time trying to come up with an image for her. For Cooper in general, this project is special. He treats such specific projects more scrupulously than others. And "Youth" for some reason did not leave us for so long. We tried to make an approach - it did not work, we did planning - it did not "go", we did visualization - the same.

And it was necessary that she lay down perfectly personally for Cooper, then everything would go in the best way and we would all move along a specific route. And so we showed him zoning, detailed planning decisions, made visualizations - well, it didn't "go well". At some stage I sat down and just drew on a planning tablet. We added cascades as well as a container stain. And this simple hand drawn graphic was so logical, we liked it so much that we decided to leave it like that.

In "Molodosta" we had an 8-meter ceiling, we could afford everything we wanted

Only two moments did not work out. In the center of the hall there is a real billiard table. I dreamed that in Kyiv there was some kind of establishment with billiards, where you could play. But at the last moment, Cooper said: "Glory, listen, in our Odesa "Molodosta" people fought the door from the entrance group. If you have cues and bullets in there, it's just murder. Therefore, let the pool table be placed, but I will take the cues and balls."

We covered it with glass and planted it. Now I understand that we would not have made billiards here, because it would not be possible to play for so many people, and there would not be such a cool central landing with a green cloth. Now it's just a nice title table, an ai-catcher.

And the second point. In the depth of the hall there is a podium landing - this is the top point from which you can see the development of the entire space. We wanted this entire alcove to be carpeted with deer and each deer's eyes lit up with a red LED. In general, Cooper and I agree on design decisions pretty quickly. But sometimes we start to "chop". For example, I say: "It has to be like this, it has to stay!"

Then he replies, "Okay, let's see." Neither of us has a controlling stake, we are always equal. But if someone is very sure of something, he insists on it. So I was sure about these carpets. We bought 20 carpets with deer and have already collected them. But then at some point, when I went on a trip, Cooper removed them. He said: "While Slava is gone, let's remove these carpets and make glass blocks."

The balbek bureau team integrated a two-level structure made of industrial containers into the interior of "Molodosti". There is a bar on the lower level, and seats on the upper level. Photo: Yevhen Avramenko

P.M.: I understand that he is not your easiest client?

S. B.: This is the most difficult client.

P.M.: But at the same time, the most interesting?

S. B.: Well, he is special. I generally try not to categorize clients as interesting or not. They are all special, they all have a dark side and a light side. The paradox is that the simpler the client is, the more difficult it is for us. The more comfortable the relationship with the client is, the more difficult it is to force yourself to do something.

P.M.: But not all difficult clients want to return.

S. B.: This is a personal choice of each architect. If at the exit he gets the result that covers all the spent nerves, then it is worth it. And yes, he must "chop", fight, curse, cry, shout. If the result exceeds emotions, then be patient and work. If you understand that you are uncomfortable, when you are depressed that the client does not like 15 of your options, but likes the 16th, then you simply do not do it. This is the choice of each person to the extent of his psychological framework. In our studio, the psychological framework is concrete. We try to find approaches to all customers.

Designers sought to recreate the atmosphere of the 90s in "Molodosta", hence the old TVs, retro furniture and Sony Playstation. Photo: Yevhen Avramenko

P.M: You visit a lot abroad. Is it work or creative pursuits?

S. B.: Everything is relative. What is "many"? If it is the States, then most often for work. If Europe and the rest of the world is mostly a vacation. Although I had one vacation in the last two years — in Japan. Now I purposefully choose the States, because there is both work and emotional and motivational content.

PM: Tell us about some interesting foreign projects that you are currently working on.

S. B.: We have two major projects in California, a country club in Palo Alto and a private residence nearby. We have been working there for a little over two years.

P.M.: But you also do projects in China?

S. B.: In China, we have already completed one project — an office of 2000 square meters. m. We are now finishing work on an office in 6000 square meters. m.

The paradox is that the simpler the client, the more difficult it is for the architects

P.M.: How was the work in China? ЦIs the client out on you?

S. B.: It was very easy. The client saw our publication and contacted us with a specific offer. The deadlines were very short, but this is our easiest project from the point of view of "promise - do - get money for work". Although it was a fast-paced job, we avoided conflicts.

But there was pressure for deadlines. Time was calculated not in months, but in weeks. Three weeks — for visualization, two — for drawings, three — for TK. It was a very busy schedule. But the result justified itself. We are currently planning a trip there for filming.

P.M.: At the end of last year, you and BURSA announced plans to turn one of the old VDNG pavilions into a P13 contemporary culture center. Can you share the details?

S. B.: For now, these are plans and intentions. BURSA is engaged in the development of this project, they have some contact with VDNG. And we were invited to be architects or curators of an architectural group. When I wrote a post on Facebook offering to join the team, about 450 people responded that they were willing to do it for free. But everything is conditionally free. We want to find investors for this building, because what can be done there alone will still not solve the problem of the entire space globally.

To attract an investor, we need a quality project. We are going to write an investment plan, which will take into account the costs of all participants, and my plans are quite long-term. I want to develop the team that has formed around this project. After all, this is not the only object that needs the attention of the Ukrainian architectural community. There is already a queue of projects that I would like to work on.

PRAGMATIKA.MEDIA journalist Olena Panchenko and Slava Balbek in the balbek bureau office (Prostir 86). Photo: Yuriy Ferendovych

PM: On a social basis?

S. B.: Well, yes, we have such a policy in the workshop: every month we spend about 10% of our energy and time on projects for which we do not receive money.

P.M.: I read that в this pavilion has a mine model.

S. B.: This is a former miner's museum, there are mines there, in varying degrees of readiness. Some are simply dug in, some have reinforcements, some have trolleys. It is very interesting!

P.M.: You thought that іcan this be done?

S. B.: No, they haven't done it yet. So far, the status of this facility is as follows: we volunteered, gathered all interested parties, and are waiting for certain actions from the management team. That is, we are at a low start.

P.M.: This year, a hotel is to open in Pechersk — another common cause of yoursєct from BURSA. At the same time, he tookI will the building of the former dormitory, from where people were evicted with a scandal. Were you interested in this story? And do you think that as an architect have dive in similar nuances?

S. B.: Yes, I think that as architects and representatives of one of the tentatively leading teams on the Ukrainian market, which they want to emulate, we certainly carry our social mission. We understood that there was a conflict, to what extent - we are not entirely sure. We were invited to a ready-made draft construction project. We were not present at the seizure of premises or the eviction of people.

Only later did they learn that there was a conflict there. Now I can say that we did wrong when we did not analyze the situation at first. Now, according to our principles, we have to finish this object in a high-quality manner, so that it does not remain unfinished. But this is a lesson for us: in the future, we should analyze the objects we are working on. Now, when we are connected to new projects, we ask that you provide us with all the information — history, schedules, ownership. It is very important for us. Our reputational risks are more important than our commercial ones.

Revitalization is often much more expensive than building a new building

P.M.: What projects will you definitely not undertake?

S. B.: For everything related to urban planning violations. What is important to us. It is clear that to some extent architecture is a matter of taste. That is, not the architecture itself, but the aesthetic result. Architecture is still a function. We try to follow all rules and regulations. Sometimes we find ourselves in a situation where they are already broken and we can no longer change them. But we in the workshop try to raise our social mission higher and higher every year. I'm not bragging now, it's just our policy.

We are about design, about architecture and, actually, about the future of the image of the city. The same Kyiv Food Market is a successful case, when a historical building retained its appearance and acquired the function of a restaurant. We can say a lot: why didn't they build a shelter, a hospital, or something else? But it was the customer's wish. We tried to be on the edge to preserve the story and bring the functionality that the client wanted.

The lobby of the BURSA hotel complex, which occupied two ancient buildings in Podil. The first — 1818 (the first chief architect of Kyiv Andriy Melenskyi lived here with his family), the second — 1856. Photo: Yevhen Avramenko

Interiors of the BURSA hotel. Photo: Yevhen Avramenko

PM: Projects in Russia taboo?

S. B.: We have a project in Dagestan: a school in a remote village in the mountains for children from the entire district. This is a non-commercial socio-cultural project from American investors. I didn't even doubt for a moment whether it was worth taking it. Very cool facility: modern architecture, computer science class, robotics. I fit into the projects of such a plan. Commercials are difficult for me purely emotionally. I choose the moment of personal interest: I want - I don't want, I can - I can't. The school project is very interesting.

To some extent, architecture is a matter of taste

P.M.: I would like to return to the topic of howoh you partially touched on preserving the authenticity of historical buildings during their reconstruction. You did a project at "Arsenal", before that you worked with BURSA в buildings of the XNUMXth century. on Podil. Your opinion: should authenticity be preserved and to what extent?

S. B.: Each project is unique. There are always some frameworks and conditions that limit you. First of all, the client's capabilities are probably the limiters. Revitalization, that is, restoration of an old building in its original form, but with new functions, is often much more expensive than demolishing and building a new one. Sometimes the client simply may not have the money for it. And this is not the only factor.

For example, old houses do not always comply with existing thermal insulation standards. And in order for them to pass, you need to build a new insulated box inside or enclose all the facades. This is a double-edged sword: either keep the beautiful concrete facade in the style of modernism, or make it alucobond with insulation. Every architect faces a choice: whether to violate the norms of Ukraine, or to violate the norms of aesthetics. Or not to fit into this project at all, in order to avoid conflict.

Interiors of the BURSA hotel. Photo: Yevhen Avramenko

There is an old building on Yaroslavov Val, in which a co-working space is currently being built. For 20 years, it stood neglected: with graffiti on the facades, behind a fence, covered with OSB. The clients now removed the entire facade, restored it, but at the same time took and added another floor-box on top. Is it good or bad? What is better: for the building to stand half-dead for another 10 years or for it to receive a complete restoration, but to acquire an additional floor? Your opinion?

P.M.: Уit all depends on the degree of intervention. One floor, I think, is not terrible.

S. B.: And one and a half? And two? And if you retreat further, make a terrace, and make the new floor completely in a mirror? The border is quite conditional. Someone will want it to continue to stand, fall apart and rot. Another will say: "Let them restore it better, but add one floor." It is always bargaining with oneself, bargaining with society. It will never happen that everyone agrees with you.

Any decision you make will be appealed. There will always be a person who will say that it should have been done differently. On the one hand, it is interesting to listen to the opinion of society, but on the other hand, people never put themselves within the framework of existing conditions. An architect needs to understand this and simply not pay attention to what others say. If you have chosen a policy of honesty with yourself, then you must be honest with yourself in all your projects. That's all.

There are limitations in any project, primarily the capabilities of the client

The Kyiv Food Market food court was placed in a closed circle around the perimeter of the room, the seats were in the center of the space. Photo: Yevhen Avramenko

On the second floor of the Kyiv Food Market, an additional closed space was planned, which is the place for conducting master classes and presentations. Photo: Yevhen Avramenko

PM: In proєKyiv Food Market і BURSA restorers worked with you. Is it your initiative or the client's?

S. B.: At Kyiv Food Market, it was the team of the developer who was engaged in the restoration of all the buildings of the complex. They restored plinths, brickwork, analyzed openings, and consulted with us regarding interior work. In the case of BURSA, when we joined the project, there was already a historical reference that we took as a tribute and followed. We were clearly set design limitations, and we adhered to them. It was not our initiative, but already established rules.

P.M.: You also actively defend Soviet modernism, while for many it is just a "scoop". Where for you is the difference between modernism і "scoop"?

S. B.: You and I are now living in a very interesting time, in the era of transition, when the buildings of Ukrainian-Soviet modernism are beginning to turn into architectural monuments, but do not yet have this status. The awareness of this comes earlier to people in creative professions, and later to people in non-creative professions, for whom both Tarilka and the Salyut hotel are a "scoop".

Of course, architects, based on the formulas of design and architecture that they were taught at KNUBA or other universities, claim that this is all good and needs to be preserved. But this, again, is all about preferences. Why should your opinion be higher than the opinion of the grandmother who sells seeds or the bus driver? You have no priority in this. They say it's a scoop. And you say that it is not a scoop. But you belong to the minority.

The fact that we have learned something somewhere does not mean that we know better. They perceive it differently, and they are the majority. It is clear that this majority needs to be shown and offered a different aesthetic reality. For them, it may seem "good" (good) or "bad" ("scoop"). But again, what is what?

An architect just needs to ignore what others say

PM: This attitude is also related to the fact that this is a part of the history that we would like to erase.

S. B.: Is Khrushchev a history?

PM: To some extent yes.

S. B.: Will we keep it? Are we going to restore all these balconies or are we going to preserve them? The Khrushchevs are just the next stage after modernism. This is also a part of history in which people live, become better or worse.

Why do we say that Khrushchevs are bad if they are super functional? And modernism, which was romantic architecture with a senseless but beautiful form, is that good? Where is the truth? Where they spent more money and made a picturesque form? Or where they spent less money, but did more good for society? Why Khrushchev is bad, and modernism is good?

The designers followed industrial minimalism in the design of the auxiliary premises of the Kyiv Food Market. Photo: Yevhen Avramenko

PM: In your opinion, what modern architectural structures in Kyiv have a chance to become architectural monuments?

S. B.: In 50 years, probably yes. Then it will be possible to assess how unique they have become in the world of architectural development. It seems to me that now architecture is developing so dynamically that soon many things will be considered monuments. Is the Sydney Opera House a landmark?

Will the new Louvre in Abu Dhabi be a landmark or already a landmark? Or is the "Water Cube" in Beijing a tourist attraction or not? At one time, the technology of inflatable facades was just a fantasy. Currently, every hundredth building has such facades. Its value is falling because new technologies allow it to be done faster and better. We live in very interesting times. Soon, 3D printers will build houses that could not even be dreamed of five years ago.

The architect's time ends the moment the restaurant starts. Then the client's time will start

PM: Another topic that I would like to discuss is the design of Ukrainian cuisine restaurants. You have it in your arsenal й Barvy, and 100 ROKIV TOMU VPERED. How do you like it? уit was possible to make non-banal interiors without towels і sarovarshchyna?

S. B.: Most of the time, this is an instruction from the client. Yes, we have our opinion, which is listened to, but still, every restaurant is the vision of the owner, the chef. If we are talking about 100 ROKIV TOMU VPERED, then there was a progressive chef who saw Ukrainian cuisine in a modern way. And with the design, we tried to emphasize his ideas. But when the client and the form of business say that we need towels and Ukrainian ornaments, the architect must make towels and Ukrainian ornaments if he wants to fit into this project.

The commercial success of the restaurant is not determined by the architect. If he refuses and does strict minimalism, the restaurant will live for three months, and then they will start painting ornaments and hanging towels, and this is the worst option. It is better to first understand what is needed for the project, determine if it will be successful, and follow the concept. At an early stage, the client and the architect must reach this understanding.

If the client "drows" for his own, and the architect - for his own, then nothing will work. It must be understood that the architect's time ends at the moment when the restaurant is launched. Then the client's time will start. Therefore, the architect must do everything the client asks. Otherwise, he has to pay himself for the unprofitability of the restaurant, empty seats in the hall, sagging kitchen.

Restaurant 100 ROKIV TOMU VPERED in the center of Kyiv. The owners of the establishment sought to rethink traditional Ukrainian cuisine and integrate their vision into a modern interior. Photo: Yevhen Avramenko

P.M.: During the operation of your studio, the attitude towards clients, towardsєwho? Is there anything you used to do that you no longer do?

S. B.: Yes, we no longer want to deal with residential apartments. Residential buildings, if we are talking about construction from scratch, we still deal with, because it is an architectural form. And apartments for us are very unprofitable. Such a project does not have an expiration date, it can be done for two or three years. It's super uncomfortable. If we were paid a salary every month, then we would be happy to design, but, unfortunately, no one works on such conditions.

P.M.: So you are not interested in it exclusively from a commercial point of view?

S. B.: First, from commercial. Secondly, from an emotional point of view. An architect who leads one project for two years withers away. It is not a good wine, and it gets worse over the years (smiles). The project should last a maximum of six months or a year if it is a big job. And if you stomp on 100 sq. m the third year, then you just get tired.

An architect who leads one project for two years withers away

Slava Balbek at the office balbek bureau (Prostir 86). Photo: Yuriy Ferendovych

P.M.: Are there such projects that are undertaken only commerciallyth look, but which ones are conceptually uninteresting to you?

S. B.: No, there are no such projects now. And there is a certain queue of orders and customers. And we choose whether we want it or not. In our priorities, commerce does not come before aesthetics. There is no need for this.

P.M.: And there are no such projects for which you are ashamed and you do not even show them?

S. B.: No, none. Previously, there were those who did not show, but now they do not.

The bright accent of the 100 ROKIV TOMU VPERED dining room was the red BB-0 chairs, created by Slava Balbek for his own furniture brand propro. Photo: Yevhen Avramenko

P.M.: And the last behindquestion. On your Facebook page, you wrote that among your plans for this year chess, sign language, Japanese calligraphy. Do such versatile hobbies help you in your work?

S. B.: I'm trying to figure out if they will help or not. For example, I believe that playing chess sharpens the mind, develops logical thinking. It is harmful for a person to always think in one plane. If you think in terms of planning and constructive solutions, then sooner or later all the other paths in your brain will grow. It is my opinion.

So I started taking chess lessons, I really like it. While you are playing chess, you don't think about anything. When you have to calculate 15 moves at once, you physically have no way to think about the project you didn't pass. It's the same with big sports. The year before and last year, I was seriously involved in triathlon. And when you train, you don't think about anything else. This is a balance. In sports you don't think about work, at work you don't think about sports.

My future hobby, as I hope, is calligraphy and sign language, which is also super cool, because it develops mentally, emotionally, and produces super skills. And whether I will use it - that is the question.