Should the activism of Ukrainians be perceived as a "red card" that society presents to developers? Where does the responsibility of companies that carry out complex development of territories begin and end? Is there still room in the tight tangle of business conditions and urban restrictions for the implementation of an architectural idea? These topics were discussed by PRAGMATIKA.MEDIA Ramil Mehtiyev, executive director of the company ENSO.
Ramil Mekhtiev, executive director of the ENSO company
PRAGMATIKA.MEDIA: Since the main theme of our volume is "Urban scenography", we would like to start with the question: what does a city begin with for you? What objects and territories set the mood, form an image?
Ramil Mekhtiev: For each of us, Kyiv begins from completely different points, we see it from different angles. For example, my opinion about European cities is formed not by how it looks and what happens in the city, not the main window, but by what the suburbs of London, Paris, Rome look like. The way people live there, the logistics of their transportation, their lifestyle. The way the suburbs of Kyiv look today makes me sad.
PM: Let's clarify, do you mean the suburbs located beyond the administrative boundary or the outskirts - Kyiv's sleeping areas?
Ramil Mekhtiev: A suburb in which live those who consciously distanced themselves from the hustle and bustle of the city, but wished to remain within the temporal reach of the center and all that we value it for. Sleeping areas are not so much a conscious choice as a forced necessity, often dictated by economic motives. Kyiv for me begins with satellite cities surrounding the capital. Just as any leader is made by his team, so the city is the result of the influence of the inhabitants not only of the center, but also of the surrounding sub-centers. We understand that life does not end behind a sign with the name "Kyiv" crossed out. But it can be significantly different. The development of the suburbs is precisely what requires special attention if we think in the long-term perspective. Cities grow and merge, today Kyiv is actually a large agglomeration, and not just a territory within an administrative boundary. This is not only architecture, infrastructure, but also all the people who daily fill the central streets with life and create a mood, influence the rhythms - all those who participate in the urban play. And most of these streams originate in the suburbs.
If we talk about architectural landmarks, everything here is also individual. Everyone has their own associative series when they hear the word "Kyiv". It all depends on the mood, the situation. I sympathize with the objects of the modern school of architecture. Undoubtedly, we share the understanding of the importance of preserving historical heritage - cathedrals, tenement houses, those examples of "Ukrainian Baroque", which are so admired by the majority. In a certain mood, I will probably be close to the architecture of the Chocolate House and the National Bank. As a person who mentally belongs to different cultures, I am impressed by the combination of different eras, styles, and schools in architecture. But if we are talking about what is close and understandable, then these are, perhaps, the objects implemented by our colleagues at Rybalskyi, the ideas of architect Andrey Pashenko, implemented in the Tetris Hall residential complex project, Signature residential complex, White Lines residential complex.
Ramil Mekhtiev, executive director of the ENSO company and Iryna Isachenko, deputy editor-in-chief of PRAGMATIKA.MEDIA. Photo: Maksym Drobynenko
PM: Do the projects implemented by ENSO reflect your preferences? Judging by the POETICA, DIADANS, FJØRD projects, you offer emphatically modern architecture without any neoclassical allusions, so beloved by Kyiv developers at the turn of the XNUMXth–XNUMXst centuries.
Ramil Mekhtiev: At this stage, yes. But this is not a subjective approach, it is not a direct consequence of the fact that we are internally oriented towards modern architecture. It is important for us, first of all, to organically integrate objects into the environment. It is impossible to promote some architectural idea without looking at the context. For example, it is rather difficult to present an emphatically contemporary object in the historical part of Podol. The question of its relevance would immediately arise. But for the locations we choose, modern architecture is organic.
However, architectural tastes are always subjective. Do you remember the discussion about the theater in Podol, designed by Oleg Drozdov? This case made me think, should architecture be liked by everyone? Everyone can have their own criteria for what is beautiful and appropriate. But the important thing is that this case showed us all: our people are no longer indifferent to the quality of the visual environment and are ready to defend their opinion. That's great! Ten years ago, society was in a sleepy state, but today, it turns out, architecture is interesting to everyone. The urban planning process itself is interesting. It is interesting that behind the scenes. And even the polarity of opinions is not bad, because it provokes a discussion. Therefore, our developer colleagues are currently implementing the next commercial project in Podol together with the same architect, as they understood the value of his views and style. And they realized that such an approach will definitely be in demand, there will definitely be those who are ready to pay precisely for an architectural idea. Thus, the price of a square meter already includes a reputational component. It is discussions and feedback that help us understand how certain requests are formed. And we, in turn, try to be guided not only by our own tastes and preferences, but also by understanding what our clients are willing to pay for with the confidence that this asset will remain relevant years later.
It is important for us to organically integrate objects into the environment. It is impossible to advance an architectural idea without looking at the context.
Today we are living a very interesting period, I would call it an architectural restart. A competition of ideas has already begun among developers. And this happens not only in the field of residential real estate, but also in office and commercial real estate. Creating something that does not have a response, or an object that does not evoke emotions, is already a thing of the past.
PM: How and to what extent can a responsible developer influence urban scenarios? Where does his area of responsibility begin and where does it end?
Ramil Mekhtiev: We do not build oases for a certain category of people. Our area of responsibility is much larger — it goes far beyond the walls and fences of residential complexes, and integrates into the infrastructure of the district. The art is not to integrate an autonomous "organism" into the fabric of the city, which is ready to cover all urgent needs within its own framework, but to have this new agent improve the quality of the entire environment. And sometimes he didn't just "improve" it, but revived it - here everything depends on the initial conditions of the location.
PM: Do you mean the revitalization of post-industrial areas?
Ramil Mekhtiev: This is about sites for complex development. Today, we came to the point that time dictates choosing a location not according to an administrative principle (in the center or on the outskirts), but guided by the scale of the project — is it possible to implement all those ideas within the given framework that will breathe new life into the territory? This is important, because the overall result will allow us to consolidate the conviction: with the arrival of this developer, the territory will not remain just a place to sleep, but infrastructure, commerce, and offices will be developed here - oriented not only to those inside the complex, but also to everyone around.
DIADANS is a business-class residential complex in the Pechersk District of Kyiv. Image source: ENSO
PM: That is, you are creating not just an apartment complex, but a center, a point of application for all residents of the district? And what role do you leave to the city, to formal city planners?
Ramil Mekhtiev: The developer's mission and social task is to partly solve infrastructural and social tasks. For example, to minimize pendulum movements, I offered people services and a place for offices near the house. Of course, we will not be able to compensate for everything - some residents will still spend hours in cars, looking for the best kindergarten, the best hospital. And here already the city must answer, we will not be able to replace the functions of city planners.
We have never sought to create the reputation of a company that is focused only on the premium segment of housing being built in the center. Our task is to create an architecture with an idea that will be the answer to the question: why are we here, for what purpose? And not just "come in and conquer the territory." For me, this definition is even unpleasant to hear. The developer does not "learn", the developer comes in order to give some new reading, bring ideas that will allow you to get everything that is necessary for a full life at a specific point on the map and will be relevant for many years. This is precisely the difference between a developer and a builder who solves purely the issues of resettlement of people in the conditions of an acute shortage of housing. Such a deficit exists — in our country, 90% of the housing stock is in dilapidated and dilapidated condition. But there is not much creativity in solving this task, and there is no need to talk about architecture.
PM: One of the reasons why thousands of Kyivans went to the March for Kyiv in early October is the lack of high-quality new architecture. Rather, the fact that there are critically few high-quality projects, but the number of faceless human sleeping bags is growing rapidly. Is the ENSO company ready to fill the deficit of quality architecture in Kyiv? In what quantities and under what conditions?
Ramil Mekhtiev: What is quality architecture? Which architecture is the most commercially successful today? There are trends, and there are statistics. Starting from statistics is a very specific version of decision-making. Statistics are about the past. Architecture and the generation of new meanings is about the future. But, responding to the challenges of the future, they must be relevant today and not contradict the past.
The key question: what exactly can we bring to the development process so that our architectural ideas are in demand and understood in the future? That's what we need to analyze, and not just adjust to some obvious requests. There is a market, there are market expectations, and you generate a product that corresponds to them - this is the simplest task. But this is not the way to set the bar, and within these frameworks it is impossible to talk about what is called creativity. It simply becomes a medium-term business that allows you to solve tasks today and now.
Therefore, the discussions, discussions, and marches that are taking place now give us the feeling that society has already matured and is ready to formulate a request for architecture. People do not only ask the question "what materials is this building made of", they want to think in categories of images. They should be offered not just an abstract rendering in a vacuum, but a living object integrated into a living street line.
The lounge area is located on the terrace of the DIADANS residential complex.
Image source: ENSO
It is impossible to quantitatively measure qualitative architecture. Quality architecture will never be measured by square meters. Our global goal is not to adapt to today's preferences, but to make sure that the innovative meanings that we invested in creating the potential for the future with architects were noticed behind our solutions. Today we have about 600 in the implementation stage. sq. m. In the next few years, this indicator will increase by at least one million square meters. In quantitative terms, we are approaching what is called a "large developer".
The nuance is that we do not aim to achieve a large portfolio in meters, we do not believe that this gives the right to claim authority. We consciously bring our projects to the market in such a way that they complement each other. Launching two or three identical sites and redistributing demand between them is not as interesting a way as working on projects aimed at different audiences and launching them so that each one appears at the most convenient time for him. We have several large projects in the stage of preparation for declaration and announcement. All of them are in Kyiv and all are connected with complex development. They will form the main quantitative pool of our portfolio. But I'm not sure that a larger project in terms of meters is more interesting than a smaller one from the point of view of architecture. Everyone has their strengths, and each of them should be a clear answer to the question: can this be called architecture, is there an architectural thought? This is what my team and I are puzzled about. Therefore, a lot of time is spent on planning, choosing solutions from several options.
PM: If we take the Zen image that formed the basis of the image of your ENSO company literally, then we can assume that you consciously chose the path to perfection. How far have you come in 4 years?
Ramil Mekhtiev: ENSO is a non-standard company, probably, and our path - long and very well-tested - is not suitable for everyone. Many business colleagues prefer to act as quickly as possible, because, as they often write in the media: "it is not known how long this holiday will last." But we operate with solutions that will be relevant not in an hour, not two or five. There will be no more land in Kyiv, there are fewer and fewer interesting sites, but entering them unprepared, without a clear understanding of how to develop a specific location in the best way, is a crime. We are in the preparation stage for a long time before we can say something to the market. During these four years, in addition to the implementation of announced projects, preparations for new ones were in full swing. So that we will scale multiple times, the increase will not be expressed in percentages, we are talking about a portfolio that will multiply many times.
The developer does not "develop" the territory,
he comes to give her a new reading.
The definition of "progressiveness" is precisely the most apt description of ENSO, as it reflects our desire to bring into the environment exactly what it lacks today. It's about not just maintaining a fragile balance, a history that I value, like most Kyivans, but to do something bigger. Today, however, there is no balance - there are too many annoying triggers on the map of Kyiv. And only those who are involved in the development process are really able to influence the situation, creating an alternative - something that will cause pride, that will remain relevant even decades later.
PM: It's easy to understand why developers rely on statistics in their planning — first of all, because these are exact numbers. But if you think that statistics are about the past, then what are you relying on? On foreign trends, hoping to implement them here?
Ramil Mekhtiev: There is simply no unified toolkit for creating forecasts with absolute accuracy. We do not refuse statistics. Creative and business aspects should complement and strengthen each other.
There is a very limited amount of qualitative analytics in Ukraine, it is provided in a dosed manner and has an applied nature depending on who ordered this analytics and on whom it is aimed. Of course, we cannot exist in isolation, not paying attention to European trends. We address And we watch what happens to the main character, the man for whom everything is created. Society develops, evolves, Europe introduces new meanings into how it is possible to live differently, better. But copying someone else's experience, taking the best, and simply repeating it will not work. Another mentality, another history. Kyiv will not become the second Barcelona or Paris, even if it is desired.
We observe how approaches evolve, we study algorithms - how these or other processes begin. We put ourselves in the place of the buyer, or rather, a citizen - that would be more correct, since the buyer is our key audience, but any of our projects affects a much wider range of people. And we are trying to predict the life of the project for the future - after all, there will be secondary sales, generations will change. And where is the guarantee that the children of the first residents, who made decisions with reference to the architecture they liked, will like it as well?
In general, this is a complex and comprehensive process in which experience, statistics, and the visionary's talent are equally important. Kyiv, which we see, did not arise in one day, it developed in a spiral, cyclically. Everyone can be wrong, pay attention - despite the unfavorable forecasts, promises that the money under the mattresses is about to run out, we see how new objects appear, locations develop.
Perhaps it will sound somewhat self-confident, but the best prognostic and analytical tool is the expertise of our team, in which I believe more than in the analysis of invited specialists.
PM: In the spring, in an interview with PRAGMATIKA.MEDIA, your colleague Sergey Korol said that ENSO deliberately refuses promising, in the commercial sense, sites in the historical part of Kyiv, so as not to damage the visual, cultural component of the city. Do you share his point of view? And if, after all, one day you allow an intervention in the historical fabric, what kind of intervention can and should it be in order to play a positive role?
Ramil Mekhtiev: Sergey did not even voice his own position, but the basic values that share everything in the team. When choosing locations, we eliminate some when we clearly understand that our intervention will disturb the established balance. Where we definitely won't be able to add anything, but on the contrary, we will cause misunderstanding of others. There is no desire to be involved in forming ambiguous messages. ENSO is a result-oriented company that we can be proud of. The image of destroyers coming to the city center, burdening the already overheated social infrastructure, is extremely unsympathetic to many companies. But I understand that it is very difficult to navigate, being in an unstable information field, where business solves its tasks, and there is no clear planning of the city environment, and even a general plan of action that would be understandable to everyone.
DIADANS residential complex is the first residential complex in Ukraine to receive the BREEAM Interim Certificate. Image source: ENSO
Today, I would not be categorical, declaring that we will not decide to show ourselves in the historical center one day. There are many heritage sites in Kyiv that are in dire need of reconstruction. Lack of intervention means that we will soon simply lose them forever. We certainly have a professional interest: how can these buildings be brought back to life, return them to the shape that the author intended, but actualize and strengthen them with the help of high-tech engineering? For now, we refuse because there are no signals that would indicate that our initiative can be supported by the public and the municipality. We would have to go through all the circles of hell to prove that we really want to save, not destroy; to find a consensus with the residents of the surrounding houses. Their current reaction and opposition to developers is dictated by the belief that usually all good intentions, all declarations are strikingly different from the result. This total mistrust forms a negative information background that prevents us from fantasizing, studying and looking for economics in such history.
In addition to permitting procedures and difficult negotiations with the public, the time factor also plays its role — it can lead to such costs that we completely exclude the business component. Bare patronage and a purely social project stretching over a decade will remain. Of course, creatively, we would be very interested in doing something similar. Therefore, I would clarify: we do not "not consider" such an opportunity, we honestly assess the risks and understand that today they are too high. And there are a lot of application points. It is enough to walk around the center, go to the second front of the streets and see what is happening there. Space is marginalized. We have something to offer. But there is no request yet. Today, society adheres to the principle: "let it be so, because we do not believe in a better tomorrow."
FJØRD is a residential complex in the Pechersk district, designed as a cascade with ten all-season terraces. Image source: ENSO
Business cannot solve this problem on its own. This should be a dialogue with the participation of at least three parties: society, business and the city. And only when a consensus is reached, relations will develop into synergy. While we are all in different camps, each of which balances in bilateral relations, and the intervention of a third party throws everyone back. But this is rather politics. We give the opportunity to resolve the situation in an evolutionary way. We would like to be greeted as a long-awaited guest, so that people understand that if this company comes, there will be an excellent result.
PM: Your portfolio includes three large residential projects at different stages of completion. Which of them would you call the "opener of the season" in the broadest sense?
Ramil Mekhtiev: In fact, there are four projects, since the POETICA quarter has combined different architectural and technical solutions from different architects under one hat, so, in fact, it is "two-in-one".
Any author could say which of his works he considers stronger or weaker commercially. But if we talk about creativity, then we love all our projects equally. When you know the advantages of each one, its appearance is always a revelation. I never singled out a "flagship project" and never divided: "Let's do the economy here, let's do architecture here, and here we'll solve some social problem."
Each of the projects carries answers to questions that are relevant specifically for this location and conditions. Can they be considered perfect? No, we always want something better, in this sense we are perfectionists. Do we learn in the process and change something based on this experience? Absolutely. Are we making any mistakes that need to be corrected? Probably. We are driven by the desire to finally get a result that we can talk about for a long time: here is a beautiful case and an excellent showcase! Our responsibility is not only the period from the beginning of work to commissioning, but also service. So that years later it would be possible to say: this complex looks exactly as it was intended! Build a little, it is necessary to provide conditions in which the complex will function at full strength. This is a huge post-sales effort.
POETICA is the "Second Collection" of a business-class residential complex in the Shevchenkivsky district of Kyiv. Image source: ENSO
PM: Is it possible to describe the current situation in Ukraine in just one sentence? Are we already out of the crisis, is the market already on the rise?
Ramil Mekhtiev: We are all running. Some know exactly where, others - for the company. It's hard for me to say what to call a real estate crisis. For me, a crisis is when, unlike progressive societies, we continue to think in the "20 square meters per metropolitan resident" paradigm. 90% of the housing stock is dilapidated and dilapidated housing. In this sense, our crisis began a long time ago and is not ending. But gradually — and probably thanks to the pandemic — a rethinking is taking place: real estate is not just an investment asset. This is primarily where, how and with whom you spend most of your time. Just "living" turned out to be very little. Everyone wants to live fully. Remember, in 2005, one-room apartments were 65 m, three-room 110-120 m, then 2009 came, and the area began to shrink rapidly. Then came the period of smart apartments and the slogans "better small, but own, than rented".
And now I see that people have again remembered the role of space, that we need a large living room, a lot of space in the kitchen, there should be elevators that do not cause claustrophobia. A person has a request for quality. It's wonderful that people have also considered the emotional side of real estate. And now they are guided by not just a rational calculation, when the main characteristics of housing are the number of meters and the distance from the subway. A similar trend in the car market is that more quality cars are appearing on the roads. And what is happening with restaurants? Everyone strives to look individual, original.
Statistics are about the past. Architecture and the generation of new meanings is about the future.
It is impossible to consider real estate as something torn out of this general context. People are no longer convinced that today it is possible to sacrifice the quality of the council tomorrow, somehow it will be tolerated; they realized that they live here and now and want to spend time in comfortable conditions and in the circle of those who do not cause rejection. A request for quality communities appeared. It is not enough for a modern person to have a limited area, he wants the architect and developer to think through not only the decorations, but also the possibilities of different scenarios a few steps ahead.
But it is still not easy for developers in the absence of clear rules of the game. It is difficult to understand the logic of town planning restrictions when there are different height restrictions for different sides of the street, for example. When you look at the map of the city and it seems that every stone here can claim to be included in the list of UNESCO World Heritage Sites, but when you look at the archives, it turns out that this is a house that was entered into the registers only because someone outstanding once stopped to spend the night there. Today this house is crumbling, but nothing can be done because the house has status.
If we want to preserve something, we must honestly answer the question: what is the purpose of the ban? Do not let the other person realize something? Well, do it yourself. And when nothing happens, it remains to watch the process of destruction. Is it really better to lose than to give an opportunity to try to save? But at least the very fact of the discussion, the very fact that this topic is being discussed is already useful.
And yet I am far from pessimistic - evolution is happening. We are moving forward, and this is already a big plus.
PM: How strongly do global trends affect Ukrainian business approaches in real estate? Are we ready to accept, for example, the recommendations of Gensler analysts from the latest Design Forecast (energy efficiency, inclusiveness, flexibility, climate stability, creation of 20‑minute districts)? Or is it just an abstract horizon for us?
Ramil Mekhtiev: The request for new values is only being formed. And all my theses about the need for after-sales service, about the implementation of innovative engineering solutions that will allow the organism to exist later, are about a whole spectrum of important trends. New requirements for environmental friendliness, energy efficiency — all this is relevant for us. For example, the DIADANS residential complex is the first residential complex in Ukraine to be certified according to the "green" BREEAM standard. We were the first to go down this innovative path, and not because statistics pushed us to it. If we approached the question statistically, what would the certification of the company give at the moment? — then we would get the answer: zero. But we believe that in the future it will be simply necessary, so it is better to hone the practice today. Yes, we received reputational bonuses, practical experience, and we will observe how our investments in energy efficiency will affect the functioning of the building. The task is not just to build, but to ensure a long and easy life of the project.
POETICA. The first park collection is a business-class residential quarter in the Shevchenkivsky district of Kyiv.
Image source: ENSO
That is why we act ahead of the curve in matters of inclusivity. It was a revelation for me to learn that today's design and architecture in detail make life critically easier for people with disabilities. Yes, new inclusive norms have appeared, but DBN is far from perfect, and the people who developed them are not always fully expert. For example, to be sure that a person in a wheelchair will be able to use the evacuation routes, it is necessary to sit in this wheelchair and try to drive. Someone will say: is it necessary to complicate everything, after all, there are not so many such people, why focus on them? But this is precisely about the quality of society, and about universal design, when attention to the needs of the minority allows solving the problems of the majority.
The company's reputation will be the justification for our investments, the arrival of which automatically means an increase in the quality of life.
We do not limit ourselves to formal compliance with regulations, but act according to the principle of looking at everything through the eyes of the user. And we partly rely on intuition. Business forecasts are not always justified. For example, the shortage of parking spaces seemed unobvious a few years ago. It was believed that the construction of large built-in parking lots is simply money buried in the ground. But today, when people began to appreciate the pedestrian space in the yards, one of the first questions of clients is: "What do you do with parking?"
The one who takes into account the majority of such factors - obvious and not obvious - will be more successful tomorrow. For us, the reputation of the company will be the justification for all our investments and the main criterion for success, the arrival of which in any location automatically means an increase in the quality of life and capitalization of the entire area.
Interviewed by Iryna Isachenko
Photo: Maksym Drobynenko
